The Magus of Java

[Antonius]

Hi mopai.

You won't find insults here. I have read "The Magus and Java." A while ago, I invited Sifu Andreas to our forum. (He politely declined.) It's nice to meet someone who has met Sifu Chang. You are very welcome on our forum.

My teacher, Sifu Wong Kiew Kit, does not post openly on these boards, though he does spend some time reading here. To the best of my knowledge, Sifu Wong has not yet read "The Magus of Java," nor has he met Sifu Chang. However, you can read about Sifu Wong's opinions here:

http://www.shaolin.org/answers/ans04b/jul04-3.html

As for "chi kung" vs. "nei kung," my opinion is that "chi kung" is just an umbrella term for many different arts of energy cultivation. We could just as easily use the term "nei kung" instead of "chi kung" for arts like One Finger Shooting Zen. "Chi Kung" is a relatively modern term, and one that you will not often find in classical texts. However, I find term very useful for general classification.

[mopai]

I have read a bit about Mo zi only from The magus of java. Interesting enough.
Still I'm glad that you and the other guys give some respects to the mopai. And we can discuss the MA side without throwing harsh words.
I'm a mopai fans, and I am always curious about the stuff of chinese legends.
Including their teachings.But until now, the mopais tend to be close about their art.
I tried for a couple of times to meditate and reach total calmness.Though it is always very hard and I dont really know I have ever reached that state or not.If I have, then It would be for a very short time.I cant maintain it for a longer period.Its so difficult to sit still in this age.I guess I will try to do the meditation tehniques like what is described in kostas' second book, Nei Kung.
According to Nei kung, a level 3 mo pai student have cut four string that hold dantian in its place, then make the dantian mobile.And they can move it at will.It feels like a soft qi lump.

I'm also wondering what's the relation about qi gong and paranormal abilities such as talking with spirits, gods, and the sort of it ?
If I wasnt mistaken, I have read from question and answer that Master Wong KK can do this at will.Is there any possibilities that he would ask the gods to teach qi gong or nei kung tehniques ?

[mopai]

Hi mopai.

You won't find insults here. I have read "The Magus and Java." A while ago, I invited Sifu Andreas to our forum. (He politely declined.) It's nice to meet someone who has met Sifu Chang. You are very welcome on our forum.

My teacher, Sifu Wong Kiew Kit, does not post openly on these boards, though he does spend some time reading here. To the best of my knowledge, Sifu Wong has not yet read "The Magus of Java," nor has he met Sifu Chang. However, you can read about Sifu Wong's opinions here:

http://www.shaolin.org/answers/ans04b/jul04-3.html

As for "chi kung" vs. "nei kung," my opinion is that "chi kung" is just an umbrella term for many different arts of energy cultivation. We could just as easily use the term "nei kung" instead of "chi kung" for arts like One Finger Shooting Zen. "Chi Kung" is a relatively modern term, and one that you will not often find in classical texts. However, I find term very useful for general classification.

Thank u for you kind words, Antonius. I have read the Q&A section before I join this forum. And that's the reason why I join this forum.
I have post a question to Q&A email address regarding the magus of java. But I guess It hasnt been replied yet.
One finger shooting Zen ? the one that is able to put down a candle ?

[Marcus]

Hello Mopai,

I would just like to welcome you to the Shaolin Wahnam forum. I have read the Magus of Java and it is a pleasure to have someone on the forum who has met Sifu Chang.

Kind regards

Marcus




Namo Amitabha Buddha Namo Amitabha Buddha Namo Amitabha Buddha

[mopai]

Thank you for your warm greeting, Marcus. I see you are a wanham instructor. I think Mr Wong KK is a great martial artist, and also a very
wise man. After reading some of the Q&A in his personal website, I
am very interested in his qi gong and his experiences regarding the
spiritual side of qi gong.
But it's a pity that he doesnt contribute and answer in this forum as well.

[Darryl]

Dear Mopai,

Welcome to the forum

As a term of respect to our Sifu, could I ask you not to refer to him as Mr Wong KK, but instead, to refer to him as either Sifu Wong, Master Wong or even just Wong Kiew Kit.

Thank you

[Antonius]

Mopai,

I'm sure many people would be interested to read more about your experience with Sifu Chang.

And yes, Darryl has given some good advice. You are very welcome on our forum, but we are obliged to be honest with you about showing respect towards Kungfu masters. I'm sure it was just an honest mistake, but it is polite to use a master's full name, not an abbreviation. For example I have not met Sifu Chang, but out of respect, I refer to him as Sifu Chang. It would be impolite to refer to him as J. Chang or Mr. John or even Sifu J.C.

Thanks!

[mopai]

OK no problem about that. I will refer him as Sifu Wong.
I feel no comfortable to say my detailed experiences with Sifu Chang. I really
dont want to exaggerate Sifu Chang's abilities in front of Sifu Wong.
But I will tell you how Sifu Chang heals people with acupuncture. I have met him a couple of times to help my parents by holding their feet which I acted as ground.Because the bioelectric current must be channeled from the patients body to the ground.
After he sticked some needles and I held my parents' feet, he continously sent a steady flow of electric current.Sometimes the current became stronger hence made their muscles jerk.Also did with my hand muscles.
My mother had a pain in her leg. Maybe she got a rheumatoid arthritis.
But after the first treatment. She could run without pain. The pain had gone.
Prior to the treatment, she could hardly walk.

If I was not mistaken, I also heard that Sifu Chang could heal cancer as well, but probability is 4 among of 7 patients. Unfortunately the 3 patients were died instantly (whose I believe the doctors and the medic have gave up treating these 3 patients and
sent them home to live their short time) and the other 4 patients were healed instantly.
Since that time, he has never attempted to heal patients with cancer.

[Antonius]

Thank you for sharing, mopai. Very interesting. So when you were acting as a "ground," you could feel Sifu Chang's energy? What did that feel like?

(By the way, I'm happy to hear that your mother is now able to walk. )

[mopai]

It felt the same like when you touch an open electric wire.The same jolt.But it was benevolent and not so intense like a 220v current.
But strong enough to make you startled.

[Antonius]

Very interesting. Thank you, mopai.

So does Sifu Chang still take patients? How did you come to meet him?

[mopai]

I think he only heals close friends and relatives now. It was a few years ago,
when he still heals patients.
I have address of a chinese doctor who could heal patients with qi.The patients said the qi feel so hot.And the doctor was able to set paper on fire as well.If you interested to meet/contact him, I will give you the address.
What about Sifu Wong ? does he heal sick people too ?

[mopai]

I've met some mo pai students, they are very humble person. There is a high degree of difference with an ordinary kung fu students, which usually are pretty arrogant.For them, "if you cant proof it, then it is a hoax".There are only a few forums where I do not get ridiculed for asking opinions or sharing thoughts about the magus of java.This forum is one of the few forum.
I will share my thoughts on forums which give some respect to Sifu Chang.

Have anyone of you heard about mao shan pai? I heard there is a very powerful kungfu taught in that lineage. Maybe a kind of shen gong.
Sometimes they use magic (black)??

[mopai]

Some notes

Guys, this is a copy a got from mopai yahoo forum : (this copy's origin is
from a post in wenwukuan forum)
A guy who wrote this copy added some notes with this mark (*) :
I added this copy with this mark (>>):
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you by chance have a copy of some of the posts at the Wenwukuan
forum? How long was the forum up and can you remember anything else
Kostas cited from the Mo-Pai text? Were there any other interesting
facts or revelations that were discussed there but have not been
mentioned in the books or at CK?<

Mostly it was re-itteration of points mentioned in the book but other
thing of interest that did come up including the following
information. Some i took as notes, others i cut and pasted and have
put these here so others may have a better understanding of why the
mo-pai may be making the choices they are + references to other
practitioners and risks. Direct information from the site i have put
in quotation marks.

1.alcohol, coffee and cigaretts do not affect training... anything
goes so long as it does not damage your nervous system, enjoy.

2.The 'Light Body' ability that occurs naturally as a part of nei
kung training had been achieved by a friend of kostas named Lee, who
is a Korean martial arts master and demos it routinely. I think he is
the one mentioned in the book so his nei kung is from a school other
than John's. He is a low level but he he can break 4 by 4's while
maintaining his 'light body'. He was able to do this as he grasped
the secret of light body well before he would of developed it
naturally in the mo pai system.

3.The levels are not set in concrete for abilities, they are merely a
guide and it is different for everyone. This is why they are so
selective and careful in their training. Also different people will
develope different abilities though some are universal.

4.Striking a person with your yang qi has the same affect whether you
have yin (to project) or not, the only difference is the strength of
your yang. Even making love is dangerious at level 2.


5."A health-related program like Chen tai chi can keep you alert and
well. Wu style might even be better at that than Chen, if the late
Mae Yue Liang and the still ornery Wang Peisheng are any example. But
MoPai neikung is not health oriented."
*I am not sure if it was in the book or forum but it was mentioned
this training can lead to an earlier death as you are altering your
energy from health uses to martial power so you have less sustaining
your body. This is why you should not train too hard.

6.Mo-pai nei kung is very similear to Tibetan gTummo yoga
"The best book I have seen written from the Tibetan standpoint is
Clear Light of Bliss. You can find it on Amazon. Many practitioners
of Tibetan Yoga have written to me saying: "hey, what you describe is
exactly like the completion stages in XYZ." Duh. Human beings have
two arms and two legs. Go figure."

7.60% of the people attempting level 3 have died
"The people who have died or been injured have suffered from strokes,
heart attacks, and kidney failure"

8."It's not a problem at all, in fact it is desired, to combine
meditation with kinetic training. This is the reason that we
recommend a practice such as tai-chi with a qualified teacher to all
who have an interest in neikung. I would say that you are very much
on the right track.

What we have seen in practice is that people who follow such regimes
will normally, in the course of five years, reach about 70% of Level
One, which is wonderful."

>>I've met a young man who could reach level 2 for only 3 years of training

9."One of the foremost living masters of neikung in China is a woman,
Yang Meijun. She is the head of a Kunlun Qi gong and martial arts
school, best known for her instruction of the Wild Goose style, which
is part of the body of knowledge she possesses."

10."The main concepts in the MoPai are universality (do onto others),
universal justice (not revenge - I have been awed by how my master
lets karma take its course without interceding, and have tried to
follow his example), submission to the Will of Heaven, freedom from
material possessions (Liao Sijo literally did not have a pot to piss
in, when he could have had anything and everything he wanted)."

[Hubert]

Thanks for sharing, mopai, that is some fascinating information.

I have just bought "The Magus of Java", and I am looking forward to reading it. It is strange how less than a year ago I would have dismissed it as rubbish without even trying, whereas know, after all I have experienced with Sifu and Shaolin Wahnam, I don't have a single doubt that it is all true...

I am not sure if it was in the book or forum but it was mentioned
this training can lead to an earlier death as you are altering your
energy from health uses to martial power so you have less sustaining
your body. This is why you should not train too hard.

I remember Jeffrey quoting a similar discussion he had with Sifu. Not sure which thread it was, but it was about why some Taijiquan master would die early, which could seem paradoxal.