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The British boxer and police chief were quite unsympathetically portrayed, but such personalities did and does exist so I'm not gonna say they played the stereotype card too heavily. Overall, I enjoyed the first movie more.
Some of Sifu's comments about the movie : the British people were not portrayed fairly as the Hong Kong government of those days was not bad . Sifu enjoyed some of the humor ( Hoong Ka master family ) . Boxer and Hoong Ka master's techniques and tactics in the choreography were better then the Wing Choon . Sifu enjoyed the 2 nd movie more then the 1 st .
As for us , we had a great course and movie trip ( with soda & pop corn )
I think the post you mentioned is in "Upcoming Wing Choon course, unveiling of more secrets" post.
Thanks, Jason. In fact, it was you who had posted those links. Can't wait for the prequel which I think seems more promising.
The fight scenes with the boxer were quite illogical. Using Philo 101, if Ip Man can beat the crap out of 10 karate blackbelts, win a top karate expert, and off a hundred armed attackers, how could he be at the mercy of 1 single boxer? By that logic, the same boxer can easily defend himself against those 100 attackers - not very likely. Or is there some theory that individual fighting is different from mass fighting. One can survive a multiple attacker situation but may not be able to handle one expert fighter?
The other thing is how the boxer could be totally impervious to Ip Man and Huang Zhennan's internal force. I would be the first to admit that there are MMA or Muay Thaii fighters, boxers and kickboxers with "Iron Shirts" of their own who can absorb blows that would crush an ordinary man, but we are talking about strikes from someone like Ip Man and the foremost Hung Gar master in Hong Kong.
Actually Sihing, it's quite simple: the fight needed to last long because it was the main fight between the central protagonist and antagonist of the story.
Huang Zhennan lost because they needed a plot device to justify the final fight.
Realistically the fight would have ended pretty quickly with a character as powerful as Ip Man and Huang Zhennan (with all the advantages they possess) going up against a very arrogant boxer.
On a side note, I really enjoyed the final fight especially when he used Hung Gar and Wing Chun together. The table top fight not so much...(I cringed when I saw the Bagua battle)
Respectfully,
Ray
"Om"
I pay homage to all the great masters of the past and the present
I liked the first movie more but the 2nd was still good (especially compared to the other crap came out in the last years). Of course Ip Man in the 2nd movie often didn't make a good use of his Wing Choon strategy and tactics but looking to the choreography as a whole (speed, techniques, variation, innovative ideas, realistic-grounded [not too much use of wires and CGI] and especially timing and flow) it was very good. Sammo Hung is still THE MAN!
In Hong Kong they loved the movie and the choreography and it's still the Honkeys which decide if the martial art was good or bad in a Hong Kong movie!
Now, finally, something is mentioned concerning the attitude of students.
I know that it's only a movie; it might not reflect the true situation in real lives.
After seeing the movie, apart from the fighting scenes, I was concerned about the behavior of applicants to learn from Yip Man. Did the applicants show respect to the Master?
Best regards,
Joko
开心 好运气 kai xin... .......hao yunqi... - Sifu's speech, April 2005
open heart... good chi flow... good luck ...
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Have we not opened up thy heart ...? (The Reading, 94:1)
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Be joyful, ..and share your joy with others -(Anand Krishna)
The students pay "respect" by first challenging the master, then, when defeated, they kneel down asking to be accepted.
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In the movie, the guy named Wong Leong, who is rescued by Ip Man in the fish market, I think is referring to Master Wong Shun Leung, who, according to Wikipedia, won 60+ martial competitions and mainly trained Bruce Lee on Ip Man's behalf.
I am your Sidai; I attended my first Intensive Course with Sifu in 2005.
Joko
开心 好运气 kai xin... .......hao yunqi... - Sifu's speech, April 2005
open heart... good chi flow... good luck ...
------------------------------------------------------------
Have we not opened up thy heart ...? (The Reading, 94:1)
------------------------------------------------------------
Be joyful, ..and share your joy with others -(Anand Krishna)
I would say the student first showed disrespect to his then potential Sifu to put it mildly. Works great in a movie like this off course, but in real life.. not so well
Minor spoilers ahead.
When the first student came to visit Ip Man he wanted to spar to "test" the master. Fair enough, but when being defeated easily he left abruptly in anger and returned with his friends to apparently teach Ip Man a lesson. Hardly respectful.
When Ip Man dispatched all of them easily they were surprised, and from then they started being respectful.
Until it was time to pay the fees..
On another note, it was interesting they incorporated a little bit of Chinese medicine in the film, with Ip Man realizing Sammy Hung's character being ill by observing his eyes.
I agree with some of the criticisms but I still enjoyed the film a lot!
I didn't like how it took Ip Man about 20 mins and 1000 punches to defeat the boxer at the end, I'd have preferred him to just destroy the boxer in 3 moves!
At first I didn't like the boxer either, I could tell by his muscles that he had never done much real boxing only weightlifting and his movements confirmed this. However I might have been a bit harsh because he was playing a boxer from the 40s or 50s and his style was more reminiscent of some of the old slugger style fighters like Jake La Motta or Rocky Graziano.
I was also surprised by his acting and that of the other English actor - not everyone can be like Robert De Niro in "Raging Bull" ie a great actor and a good boxer too, so usually film studios have to compromise with someone who is an experienced boxer but inexperienced actor (like Gary Stretch in "Dead Man's Shoes"), or an experienced actor but inexperienced boxer (like Brad Pitt in "Snatch").
But the worst bit was when the boxer went into the ring and wanted to fight the Kungfu people after he had already completed his own fight! A professional boxer would never absolutely never ever ever do this without agreeing how much extra they would be paid for it first! You'll always hear them say "I don't hit anybody for free!"
On the other hand, some of the boxing was awesome! When they put you in the head of the Kungfu fighter and gave that experience of what it feels like to be on the end of a beating from a boxer, this was tremendously well done. It was the best attempt at this I have ever seen apart from Raging Bull which is the greatest boxing film ever.
Other things I loved about the film were the sets and shooting - it really beautifully transported the viewer back to Hong Kong in that time.
Also I really loved the emotion and the humour throughout the movie, I was certainly smiling from the heart throughout it!
P.s. If you have never seen "Dead Man's Shoes" or "Snatch" I recommend them. If you have never seen "Raging Bull" leave this thread immediately and watch it!
The fight scenes with the boxer were quite illogical. Using Philo 101, if Ip Man can beat the crap out of 10 karate blackbelts, win a top karate expert, and off a hundred armed attackers, how could he be at the mercy of 1 single boxer? By that logic, the same boxer can easily defend himself against those 100 attackers - not very likely.
Hi Wuji, I see what you mean, but I think Ip Man and the Boxer could both be awesome fighters, then it makes sense no? I wasn't sure what level the boxer was supposed to be, but I think he was supposed to be the British professional heavyweight champion of the time, so I think such a person could beat a lot of attackers. I only know two professional boxers, they are around the light welterweight size ie 10 to 10.5 stone and they could both handle a good few attackers in fact I've seen security video footage of one of them doing that against about 5 or 6 attackers!
Then again Ricky Hatton and Bernard Hopkins have both said that even for them if there is more than 5 they'll struggle so you are probably right!
Or is there some theory that individual fighting is different from mass fighting. One can survive a multiple attacker situation but may not be able to handle one expert fighter?
In terms of external arts there is. Its generally accepted that a good grappler (wrestler or jujitsu) will beat a good kickboxer in a one on one fight but that for defence against a multiple attack its better to be good at kickboxing.
The question I have for anyone who knows, is how good was the real Ip Man's combat purported to be?
Where was he in terms of Bruce Lee for example?
Last edited by drunken boxer; 2 June 2010, 08:34 PM.
Reason: add the word heavyweight
I agree drunken boxer but a professional boxer would not be a match for a kung fu master it would end in a few hit's, it would be like a boxer in a cage match against a pro UFC fighter. The fight was entertaining though
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