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Abstention in drinking/eating meat and Karma

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  • #16
    Hi Mark,

    From the information that I have received, there are terrible abuses that take place in the raising and slaughtering of animals. As a young college student, it deed indeed sound bad. That's why I became a vegetarian, and that is why now, I have become a hunter. I don't have any links for you regarding commercial livestock raising . This was years ago that these issues were brought to my attention. The sources seemed quite reliable and the farming practices described were quite lamentable. I do not know how widespread these practices are, though I suspect that many big businesses run their farms this way. Perhaps I should look this up online?

    Actually, it seems that "taking responsibility for these actions" is not quite the correct phrase. If we are participating in this system, as consumers, then we are contibuting to any wrongdoing done to the animals, no? In this way we share in the responsibility.

    With All My Best,
    Last edited by Charles David; 16 January 2007, 09:44 PM. Reason: Addendum
    Charles David Chalmers
    Brunei Darussalam

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    • #17
      Dear Siheng,

      I don't doubt the poor treatment. I just don't understand to what extent I am responsible for this poor treatment, and what that means for me and for others.

      Mark
      少林華南台灣 Shaolin Wahnam Taiwan

      Facebook

      "Then how could chi kung overcome diseases where the cause is unknown or when there is no cure? The question is actually incorrect. The expressions "the cause is unknown" and "there is no cure" are applicable only in the Western medical paradigm. The expressions no longer hold true in the chi kung paradigm. In the chi kung paradigm the cause is known, and there is a cure."

      -Grandmaster Wong Kiew Kit

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      • #18
        Hi Mark,

        We are responsible to the extent that we participate in the system by eating the animals. And, of course, it means different things to different people.

        Still,
        Charles David Chalmers
        Brunei Darussalam

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        • #19
          In one of his books, I forget which one, Thich Nhat Hanh advocated mindful eating--being mindful of the provenance of the food, the supply chain, and the process that it took to generate the food you are eating. This goes beyond thinking about the Taco Bell employee who fried up your chalupa, but to think about all the chihuahuas needed to make that chalupa (just kidding ). But thinking about the process of say, an orange growing from a tree, back to the tree's origins--it's first sowing into the ground and the like. I believe this is what Sihing Charles is getting at--we can make choices at the market, ones that can make a slight difference. Buying sustainably farmed meats and veggies tells the people further on down the line, "hey, we care about where our food comes from" &c. This hearkens back to the tightly woven chains and nets of causation and dependencies (what Master Thich Nhat Hanh calls "interbeing"). Hope this helps a bit...

          Chow

          PS the Slow Food movement is all about this sort of "consumer activism"

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          • #20
            A buddhist tenet forbids to drink alcohol.

            The Shaolin monastery was an exception (Emperor Tang Taizong gave the Shaolin monks permission to drink and eat meat).


            A question on this:

            At the highest levels; music, or feelings, whatever that starts a stir, brings you back to the phenomenal realm.

            If you still listen to music, have feelings, want sex, does it matter then if you stay away from alcohol?


            Tim

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Pure Blade View Post
              A buddhist tenet forbids to drink alcohol.

              The Shaolin monastery was an exception (Emperor Tang Taizong gave the Shaolin monks permission to drink and eat meat).


              A question on this:

              At the highest levels; music, or feelings, whatever that starts a stir, brings you back to the phenomenal realm.

              If you still listen to music, have feelings, want sex, does it matter then if you stay away from alcohol?


              Tim
              Heyyo,

              To me Zen is all about balance, is it not?

              If someone drinks a lot and makes a fool of themselves, that isn't balanced, just like if someone has sex with a bunch of random people and contracts STD's, that isn't balanced, or if someone listens to music so loud it destroys the eardrum, that isn't balanced. I think it is ok that we can enjoy ourselves in a balanced way right up until we decide it is time for us to take a monk's vows.

              Take it easy Sisook!

              -David
              Shaolin Wahnam USA

              "Every morning you are born again. What you do today is the most important thing".

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              • #22
                To me zen is all about staying in the now Can we even try to put zen in words hahaha??? Or better said, should we even try??? Hehe.

                In regards to my previous question, it was more of a matter in kinds of, if one still have sex, or enjoys music, then why try to abstain from a drink if you enjoy it.

                To your question, yes, I agree, but if you enjoy it, by all means, enjoy it

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