Samurais and Ninjas against shaolins kung fu or tai chi quans !!! !!

[HugoDarien]

Hello to all of you!

I wonder how can a shaolin or tai chi quan master defend against a ninja or samurai master whit a Hattori Hanzo sword or a normal sworld which technique would the taichi or shaolin master use unarmed and which wapen should hi use if he could choose to figth a Hattori Hanzo sword or a Samurai Katana Sword!!?? Thanks !!! !!

[Jma]

http://www.7secondsoflove.com/ninja/

[Simon]

Hears a good pun,

Hugo, Jma, I like a bit of ska but not the scar from a samuri sword! ha ha ha.
I can only speak from a philysophical point of view but... the classic 'avoid the strenghts attack the weakness' comes to mind. Leaving aside the obvious picking up a chair, throwing things and running (I was once in a pub when someone pulled out a samuri sword, you have never seen a building empty so quickly). I would try for a 'no defense, direct counter' and just keep very close, keep pushing/pressing. Stay within very close range thus taking away his advantage (or trying to) while using your strenghts (bare hands) against his weakness (how well can you defence with both hands on the hilt of a sword?).

Cheers

Simon

[Chiahua]

...I was once in a pub when someone pulled out a samuri sword, you have never seen a building empty so quickly

Makes me wonder: what kind of pub would let a guy with a samurai sword get drinks, and what kind of freak carries around a samurai sword in the first place. What even more funny is that the guy probably got the sword in a flea market or over the internet and thus probably better for show.

[HugoDarien]

Ninjas against shaolins kung fu or tai chi quans !!! !!

THANKS FOR YOUR ANSWERS but wha about if you are in some strett corner that is small like 2 cars and very long whit out any exit only you can turn left or right about 30 meters ahead from there you are and now you see a samurai master coming to you from 15 meters from there you are saying that hi going to kill you and hi have the sword in his hand! what would you do_?

[Jma]

Seriously:

In Shaolin quan you would probably use golden bell or iron vest kung fu (I think Sifu Wong teaches this to his inner chamber disciples not to everyone),
in which case you would be immune to the blade attacks.
Then you would use dimmak skills to inhabilitate them.

In Taiji quan you would probably get in close (I´m not sure they have golden bell or iron vest) and use some dimmak causing as least harm as possible.

Don´t ask me for details as I am not either a master, inner chamber student, or even student of Sifu Wong´s.

[Simon]

JMA,

you will be pleased to know that the technique for developing Golden Bell are taught from virtually the start of a students training. But just like all other Shaolin arts it's all in the correct and persistant daily practice (years). After practicing Shaolin for this length of time I would hope that good stance work would be enough to avoid the sword rather than testing Golden Bell.

Dim mak is not needed. If you are skilled enough to be in striking range then just hit them!

Sunyata,

do you mean that the $99 ninja sword I plan to buy from knifesilike.com won't be hand forged and folded hundreds of times?

Cheers

Simon

[cnholmes]

I've never been in this situation and I hope I never am. I would certainly try to escape.

However, for the sake of the discussion, if forced to tackle a swordsman here's what I suggest.

If you're wearing a jacket or something you can remove quickly, roll it up to try and grab the blade. I'd probably try grabbing the blade about half way down to gain control by leverage. If he then draws the blade away to try and slash I'd let go and tame it with the jacket moving in for a strike, if he stabs it towards me I'd push it to one side and tame it moving in for a strike.

Or if you can't do that - wait until he swings at you and avoid the blade, moving back in immediately to get in close and grab for that sword handle. Grab his hands to try and gain control with the sword pointed away from you. Stamp on his foot as hard as you can. Then use stances, qinna and felling techniques to try and disabled him.

Remember, a good swordsman can use the weapon at zero range. Also keep in mind they can let go with one hand.

Whatever you did - you'd need to be incredibly fast to get away with it.

Chris.

[Jamie Robson]

'Back To Earth'

The Swordsman is unskilled -

Lure him/her into striking at you. Evade and counter 'while the old strength is spent and before the new strength gathers'. The pattern should be combat ending, so there is no further need to wrestle the weapon from them.

The Swordsman is skilled -

Throw something heavy and run. I doubt many of us here could defeat a skilled swordsman unarmed.

[Sifu Stier]

Lions and Tigers and Bears...Oh, My!

This entire topic is reminiscent of a plethora of meaningless questions posed by various people throughout past years such as: "What would you do if a giant of a man with a towing chain attacked you while you were seated in the middle of your morning crap?".....or "How would you handle 20 street gang fighters with knives and guns on a slippery slope of uneven terrain with the sun in your eyes?"....."Do you think your kung-fu could defeat Bruce Lee or Chuck Norris or Steven Seagal or....?" These are questions I have actually been asked!

C'mon! Seriously.....what's the point of such discussions? If you're that hungry for the improbable and bizzare scenarios of such questions.....consider viewing any of the many horror films that are available such as 'The Texas Chain Saw Massacres'.....and leave the forum posting to folks who have actual 'real life' questions and concerns regarding the martial arts!

[Darryl]

Holistic

What would you do if a giant of a man with a towing chain attacked you while you were seated in the middle of your morning crap?

Be extremely thankful that I was already sitting on the toilet

While I agree that these threads are - strictly speaking - not neccesary, I disagree that they serve no purpose. Such hypothetical situations allow someone to consider their actions, to demonstrate their level of understanding and potentially, save their life by preventing them from doing a completely and utterly foolish thing.

Also, there are snippets of genuinely valuable advice as well, such as ..

.. a good swordsman can use the weapon at zero range. Also keep in mind they can let go with one hand

.. which then demonstrates blindspots and gaps, both within someone martial prowess and in their thought process. This then promotes flexibility, an ability to adapt and flow and most importantly, demonstrates problem solving abilities. While some of these skills may not be viewed as extremely valuable within the martial circles, many employers love to hire people who can think in these ways. Since Shaolin Wahnam wishes their students to advance in all areas (not just martial ones), threads such as these work on several levels, from the initial beginnings of the martial arts to the demonstration of skills and flow.

[HugoDarien]

Samurais and Ninjas against shaolins kung fu or tai chi quans !!! !!

Hello and good moments too every one!

Jma genuine tai chi quan kan use dimmak So saids master Erle Montaigue> http://www.taijiworld.com/welcome.htm

Thanks for all your replies realy, now which wapen do you think is good to use agaings a samurai or ninja whit a sword, I know any wapen kan b good but do some one know which is the best wopen agaings a Katana sword or normal Sword? I wonder because on the discovery chanel they said that the katana sword was the ultimate wopen agaings any wopen!

Thanks to all! I remenber Sifus answer in my favorite book> the complete book of shaolin!> the marvelous is the ultimate fighter!. Some times a marvelous fighter need to use Chin na or in some warfare hi sure use dimmak, because the many fighters that he must strike down! When yu use Zen you kill fast not torturing some one so dimmak is the faster way in warfare!

Remenber Great Master Sifu Ho Fatt Nam uses Chin na and Dim mak agains 30 peoples whit wapens in their hands but Venerable Ho Fatt Nam get out of the fight alive and even the enemies let Sifu Ho Fatt Nam alive

of course there is a faster way too get out of some kind of evil samurai master and that is to send energi boll to him so he kan fall to the ground unconscious or even death if he use 100 % energi force remenber shaolin fist, cosmos palm and one finger Zen kan kill meters away
, ok thanks!
Ok thats enought for now sorry my inglish I just dont have microsoft world !

[karasu]

True Ninja & Samurai Facts

Helo Every One

I think that a brief actual comparison of shaolin kung fu/tai chi chaun and samurai jujutsu / ninja fighting arts properly refered to as ninpo bugei taijutsu

The samurai sword functions like both a straight sword and a sabre simultaneiously in one weapon, and can be held in one or two (preferrably) hands. This weapon is made of zazor sharp memtal generally cutting through approximately 3 people to be consideered adequate. The ninpo taijutsu sword is unique and not very well known, but generally smaller than a smaurai sword and often held in one hand. So the samurai sword in the hads of a skilled swordsman is more versatile and deadly to face then either a straight sword or sabre

The principle of samurai and ninja fighting arts is based on strategic repositioning and directly counterstrike and/or trap/lock the attacking limb (limb destruction) The guiding principle is destroy what ever comes into range. The two styles differ in that the ninpo taijutsu is tends to be more elongated and operate longer range, where as samurai jutusu which also includes striking tends to be more upright. Keep in mind that these are general chararistics and ther are exceptions in each catagory.

So regarding sword play and unarmed fighting the general strategies would be the same, shaolin fighter might be more inclined fo fight at a slightly closer range and try to create an opening to attack through, where as ninja/samurai are more likely to wait for the attack and use a direct counter/no defense. Often attacking the limbs and then follow up with a strike/cut to the torso.


Historiacal fact: ninja were the long time personal bodygurads of the Japanese emporer and his family and Japan's first police force once the shogun took power because only the nija possesed the skill to effectively subdue an armed samurai with out harming him (was a capital offense at tthat time)

The questions raised are valid and deserving of a response - hence your reponse
But lets not get carried away with all the movie ninja nonsense.

Warm regards

PS
Those that are interested in authentic ninpo taijutsu information can google Genbukan and they will find a host of sites. Included there a site by Grnadmaster Tanemura and Roy Ron which may be interest to you

Have a good one


Gord

[George]

Makes me wonder: what kind of pub would let a guy with a samurai sword get drinks, and what kind of freak carries around a samurai sword in the first place.

When I used to live in Coventry I heard a police statistic that they confiscated at least 5 such swords per year from people on the streets. That was before Kill Bill hit the cinemas.

[Maxime]

Who said ancient weapons were not used today?

A few years ago in my neighbourhood a guy has been arrested by the police: he was carrying an axe, a sword and a .357 magnum on him (everyday). But that day as the guy was smashing street parking meters with his axe in broad daylight, I guess the police thought it was time tu put him behind (more solid) bars...

To think about: avoiding living in such areas, and avoiding guys carrying an axe, a sword and a .357 magnum (unless he's acting on the shooting of the following of 'Kill Bill' ).

Maxime