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  • #31
    Wu Wei or Entering Tao

    Well,

    'The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.
    The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.'

    (dao ke dao, fei chang dao;
    ming ke ming, fei chang ming.)

    Lao Tzu, ch.1

    Don't do anything, and everything will be done.

    It is beyond intellectual expectations.

    Maxime
    Last edited by Maxime; 13 April 2006, 07:48 AM.

    Maxime Citerne, Chinese Medicine, Qigong Healing & Internal Arts

    Frankfurt - Paris - Alsace


    France: www.institut-anicca.com

    Germany: www.anicca-institute.com

    Comment


    • #32
      Laozi

      Originally posted by Maxime
      Well,

      'The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.
      The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.'

      (dao ke dao, fei chang dao;
      ming ke ming, fei chang ming.)

      Lao Tzu, ch.1
      My french brother and many siblings,

      here is an interesting interpretation of the 1st chapter of the Daodejing.

      "The way can be expressed, but not as a fixed path;
      terminoligy can be designated, but not as fixed labels.
      Nonbeing is called the begining of heaven and earth;
      being is called the mother of all things.
      Therefore constant non-being is used to observe the subtle,
      while constant being is used to obsereve that which comes about.
      These two come from the same source but have different names.
      Both are called mysteries.
      The mystery if mysteries is the gateway of subtleties."
      -"Opening the Dragon Gate" Chen, Zheng (Cleary) p.158

      When I read this translation it hit the spot. Especially with my present study of chinese.

      And by the way, I personally recommend to anyone the long and deep road of studying Ancient Chinese (古文 guwen) I have barely scratched the surface and flowers have begun to bloom.

      Best Wishes

      Adam Kryder

      Comment


      • #33
        I have read the Dao De Jing many times (in its original version, although Chia Hua has brought to my attention there are other versions) but I have found the best way to understand it is to experience it.

        I thought I would share my real life experience in the wonders of wu wei. Recently, I was given the opportunity to join a Taijiquan Push Hands class. This is a high-level class and would have enhanced my combat training greatly. However, my work committments make it very difficult to arrive early and it would also take time away from my family. So, i prayed and trusted God to do his thing.

        On the day of the first class, I had a meeting at 5 pm which was expected to end early, and i could go for the class at 7.30. 7.30 came and went, and the meeting was in full swing, but I figured there was still time to catch most of it. As time dragged on, it became clear I would not be able to attend the class. The meeting ended promptly at the time the class would have ended at 9.30. If that is not the clearest example of my decision being made for me, i don't know what it.

        In a previous time and age, I would have been increasingly frustrated in the course of the meeting, but I was strangely serene and was in fact very cheerful because i knew that God was answering my prayers and giving me the answer I was seeking. I now understand what the priest when he says "let go and let God". It used to be a intellectual thing but things are really different if you go with the flow of the Spirit / Universe / whatever you call.

        I have countless examples of just letting be, but I need not bore you folks here. Another quick example - I was desperately looking for a toilet that day, and could not find one. Well, I didn't curse or anything but figured there is a reason this was happening. I finally left the building i was in and crossed the street to find one. When I was done, I came out only to meet someone I had not met for a while. And the amazing thing was, he would normally never have been around that area at that time.

        The change in me has been imperceptible, from a person always frustrated at little inconveniences and obstacles like traffic lights or other delays, to being able to revel in each moment. It is without doubt the benefit of my Shaolin qigong training. Is it the qi flow I do daily that helps me to flow with the circumstances, or is it the standing meditation or the one-pointed mind in my Taijiquan form training? I don't know and I don't care. To quote the McDonald's ad "I'm loving it!" (incidentally, a very Zen tag line, don't you think).

        P/s - those of you Harry Potter fans should check out the chapter in the HBP where he drinks the Felix potion- i felt his experience was very reflective of qi flow.
        百德以孝为先
        Persevere in correct practice

        Comment


        • #34
          Lg&lg

          Dear Wu Ji,

          Thanks for sharing your experiences. I have been following this thread and the very phrase which came to my mind is the one which you used:

          Let go and Let God

          I am happy to know that your training is bearing such wonderful fruits.
          I am also happy to report that I am enjoying a similar increase in patience and acceptance of life's gifts.


          Your Kung Fu Brother,
          Charles David Chalmers
          Brunei Darussalam

          Comment


          • #35
            I like the phrase too, and echoing brother Charles, attain the same result as well.

            Let go and let God,


            Thanks,
            Joko
            开心 好运气
            kai xin... .......hao yunqi... - Sifu's speech, April 2005
            open heart... good chi flow... good luck ...
            ------------------------------------------------------------
            Have we not opened up thy heart ...? (The Reading, 94:1)
            ------------------------------------------------------------
            Be joyful, ..and share your joy with others -(Anand Krishna)

            Comment


            • #36
              Dear brothers and sisters,

              'The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.
              The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.'

              This chapter has profound meaning, directly related to Wu Wei.

              Can anyone elaborate about this?

              Maxime Citerne, Chinese Medicine, Qigong Healing & Internal Arts

              Frankfurt - Paris - Alsace


              France: www.institut-anicca.com

              Germany: www.anicca-institute.com

              Comment


              • #37
                Maxime :
                Close your eyes, relax, let go and tell me : What is the opposite of silence?
                Papalo

                Comment


                • #38
                  'The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.
                  The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.
                  This very first sentence of Tao Te Ching is the essence of the Tao Te Ching. If one can understand this first sentence well, he does not need to read further.

                  In my opinion, it is similar to Muhammad's teaching: 'There is nothing but GOD', which is also the core essence of all his teachings.

                  In Sifu's teaching, : Everything in the Universe is all the same.

                  So why not surrender? "wu wei"


                  Best regards,
                  Joko
                  Last edited by joko; 23 April 2006, 12:48 AM.
                  开心 好运气
                  kai xin... .......hao yunqi... - Sifu's speech, April 2005
                  open heart... good chi flow... good luck ...
                  ------------------------------------------------------------
                  Have we not opened up thy heart ...? (The Reading, 94:1)
                  ------------------------------------------------------------
                  Be joyful, ..and share your joy with others -(Anand Krishna)

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    'The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.
                    The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.
                    One thing is sure:
                    Although Tao cannot be explained, we can feel and experience it.

                    Joko
                    开心 好运气
                    kai xin... .......hao yunqi... - Sifu's speech, April 2005
                    open heart... good chi flow... good luck ...
                    ------------------------------------------------------------
                    Have we not opened up thy heart ...? (The Reading, 94:1)
                    ------------------------------------------------------------
                    Be joyful, ..and share your joy with others -(Anand Krishna)

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Dear All ,

                      I have not been taught in Taoism, with the exception of learning a few things from one of my Chinese Medicine teachers. Most of the following is coming from these teachings, as passed down to me by my teacher, who learned in return from his teacher, Master Leung Kwok Yuen.
                      Originally posted by joko
                      This very first sentence of Tao Te Ching is the essence of the Tao Te Ching. If one can understand this first sentence well, he does not need to read further.
                      In the post above as well as others, my brothers have already touched the essence. Why? I shall try to grasp it through another way, although using intellectual means is a paradox to explain transcendantal reality. Some people who may not have been exposed to the wonders of Chi Kung or to any kind of spiritual teachings might not be able to understand (through direct experience or with their intellect) the essence of the first sentence of the Dao De Jing.

                      'The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.
                      The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.'

                      Dao De Jing, chapter 1

                      Why are these first two verses from the Dao De Jing related to God, Ultimate Reality or the transcendantal realm?

                      The title of this Classic already gives us a clue.

                      Dao De Jing,
                      or
                      The Classic (Jing) of the Principle (Dao) and its Manifestations (De)

                      What is the Great Principle (Dao)?

                      The Great Principle evokes the Origin of what is manifested, i.e what we can ‘consider’. In other words, the Origin (non manifested) that gives birth (manifested) to all phenomena. What can we ‘consider’? Every manifestations, from a friend to the sky, from a single thought to a flower, a feeling, a smell, a word, a screen, a voice, an emotion, everything that is manifested, but – this is important - excluding the Great Principle.

                      The Great Principle (Dao) is beyond the manifested (De), and gives existence to the manifested.
                      In other words, the trancendantal realm is beyond the phenomenal world. Non manifested and manifested. Transcendantal and phenomenal.

                      In the Dao De Jing, we find many times the notion of ‘No’. Like ‘no action’ or ‘no thoughts’. Thinking of this ‘No’ in a pessimistic way would be both dualistic and misleading. This ‘no’ is not negative, neither it is a negation. Actually this refers to Wu Ji, or no action.

                      In other words, this notion of Wu Ji means EVERYTHING BUT THE MANIFESTED. Or in other words, as quoted by my brother Joko, NOTHING BUT GOD. Now we see clearly the danger of dualistic thinking : from an apparent pessimistic negation, it turns out to be an optimistic realization!

                      Non being, absolute, eternal! Everything in the Universe is all the same!

                      When one reaches this state of ‘no’ state, that is Wu Wei.

                      For example, being in the Chi Kung state of mind is no thought, no action (related to the phenomenal world), in other words everything else than acting or thinking (through the phenomenal world). Obviously, this does not mean that nothing is happening, only letting the Great Principle in full command.

                      Immerging oneself into the Cosmos.

                      Indeed, there is a hierarchy in those relationships.

                      In the Art of Chi Kung, Sifu quotes and explains:

                      Originally posted by Sifu
                      Tao creates One. One creates two. Two creates three. Three creates everything in the universe.’
                      The great wisdom of this saying becomes apparent when we realize that Tao means the Ultimate Reality, one means the cosmos, two means yin and yang, and three the positive, negative and neutral charges of energy.
                      Nothing creates Tao, from whom everything originates.

                      Which reminds me of the saying:

                      Thinking before acting, praying (contemplating) before thinking.

                      Like the Spirit governs the Chi, and the Chi governs the Body. Within the Spirit, our Universal Mind (Transcendantal Soul) governs our mind, our mental (Phenomenal mind).

                      Now let’s return to the first verse of the Dao De Jing again:

                      'The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.
                      The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.'

                      As soon as we start a process of description, of definition, of consideration, then we enter in a process of delimitation. How can we delimitate what is beyond limitation? How can we delimitate what creates both limitation and delimitation? We can’t, and as soon as we enter this process, we come out of the state of Wu Wei and leave the Tao (the Great Principle).

                      ‘The Tao that can be described in words is not the eternal Tao.’
                      In other 'words' , each manifestation (phenomenom) –i.e what we can consider- has an Origin (the Great Principle) beyond: with logic, if this is manifested (considered as a phenomenom), then it can’t be its Principle at the same time!

                      ‘The name that can be named is not the eternal Name.’
                      When we are in the Chi Kung state of mind, letting go and letting God, we don’t interfere with a process (i.e a manifestation), so that the beauty of the transcendantal Origin will express itself by his own wonderful and mysterious ways. But as soon as we enter in a differenciation state (i.e outside of a ‘no state’), with a process of description, definition or consideration (or any manifested thoughts) we may leave the Chi Kung state of mind.

                      If we desire to grasp (which belongs to phenomenal, manifested) what cannot be grasped (transcendantal, non manifested), then we should not try to grasp it at all.

                      Or to quote my brothers:

                      So why not surrender? "wu wei"
                      Let go and let God.

                      Maxime
                      Last edited by Maxime; 30 April 2006, 01:08 PM.

                      Maxime Citerne, Chinese Medicine, Qigong Healing & Internal Arts

                      Frankfurt - Paris - Alsace


                      France: www.institut-anicca.com

                      Germany: www.anicca-institute.com

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Dear Maxime,

                        Thanks, brother.

                        You explained it beautifully.

                        How could you read my mind?

                        And thank you, Sifu, for revealing the truth for us,
                        your guidance, and supporting us in many ways.

                        Joko
                        开心 好运气
                        kai xin... .......hao yunqi... - Sifu's speech, April 2005
                        open heart... good chi flow... good luck ...
                        ------------------------------------------------------------
                        Have we not opened up thy heart ...? (The Reading, 94:1)
                        ------------------------------------------------------------
                        Be joyful, ..and share your joy with others -(Anand Krishna)

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by joko
                          How could you read my mind?
                          No, how could you read mine?

                          No, how could we read each other's minds?

                          Hmmm...

                          Are there Joko and Maxime 's minds anyway?

                          When we close our eyes and let go, my kind brother, you and me are one.

                          Maxime

                          Maxime Citerne, Chinese Medicine, Qigong Healing & Internal Arts

                          Frankfurt - Paris - Alsace


                          France: www.institut-anicca.com

                          Germany: www.anicca-institute.com

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Jeffrey Segal
                            What does Wu Wei mean to you and what role does Wu Wei take in your training??
                            we are alway's in the state of the uncarved block. manisfestation is based on assimilation.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Maxime
                              No, how could you read mine?

                              No, how could we read each other's minds?

                              Hmmm...

                              Are there Joko and Maxime 's minds anyway?

                              When we close our eyes and let go, my kind brother, you and me are one.

                              Maxime
                              Nice.

                              Best,

                              Ray
                              "Om"

                              I pay homage to all the great masters of the past and the present

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Borg

                                Hey Uki,

                                Originally posted by uki
                                we are alway's in the state of the uncarved block. manisfestation is based on assimilation.
                                Is that like on Star Trek when Picard gets assimilated by the Borg?


                                Best,
                                Andy
                                There is no saint without a past, and no sinner without a future. ~Shri Haidakhan Babaji

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