Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 21

Thread: What is a Master / Grand Master?

  1. #1
    Andrew's Avatar
    Andrew is offline Sifu Andrew Barnett - Chief Instructor, Shaolin Wahnam Switzerland
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Klosters, Switzerland
    Posts
    7,160

    What is a Master / Grand Master?

    This question seems to arise more and more often. Recently during a seminar with a group of medical practitioners, the question was again raised. Those present mostly assumed that a certificate (for example from a national association) would be enough to show the person was a Master.

    But what is a Master really? And what then is a Grand Master? How can people find out who is a real Master / Grand Master and who is not?

    Ideas / thoughts?

    Andrew
    Sifu Andrew Barnett
    Shaolin Wahnam Switzerland - www.shaolin-wahnam.ch
    Flowing Health GmbH www.flowing-health.ch (Facebook: www.facebook.com/sifuandrew)
    Healing Sessions with Sifu Andrew Barnett - in Switzerland and internationally
    Heilbehandlungen mit Sifu Andrew Barnett - in der Schweiz und International

    Chi Kung Courses : 3t0h September 2017 in Landquart CH
    QEA Discussion Forum: www.qea.ch/forum



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    440
    Very good question Andrew. I think there is no other demarcation criteria than social status: Master is a person that is widely accepted as a Master of certain art. Same thing with Grandmaster. To me Grandmaster means just elderly master who has perhaps students who are masters themselves -- but ultimately what matters is the social acceptance. If most people, who are of course involved somehow with similar art, call person X as a Master or Grandmaster, then he or she is. In every case there will be some people who disagree that X is a Master or Grandmaster.

    Sincerely,
    Panu

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    119
    I have to agree with Ovidius here, I think a Grandmaster is the master of masters.
    As for a master, I have met few who would even call themselves one. Only the pretenders would have the cheek to call themselves master.
    I have been involved in Martial Arts and contact sports for about 27 years in one way or another and one thing I am definitely not is a Master. If anything, I realise how little I do know the more I learn or practice. Ok, there are aspects that I am good at and can show a reasonable level of skill at, but there is so much more that I have alot to learn.
    It's a pretty subjective title.
    How, then, do we find a master? Well it depends what you are looking for and what you will settle for. Do you want lots of knowledge and very little substance, or concentrated learning in a smaller area?
    It look like I will be rambling for ages on this, so I'll let someone else have their say but I'll just finish with one more question: Does a master have any more to learn?

    Cheers,

    Richard

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Gainesville, Florida
    Posts
    5,414
    On the other hand, I met someone recently who's been doing Taijiquan for over twenty years and says, "I'm nowhere near mastery!" Perhaps it's false humility, but if it's true, then I have to wonder. Twenty years of practice and not even close to mastery? That tells me something is wrong.

    I am no master, but if after 20 years of practice I cannot honestly call myself (or be called) at least a low-level master, then I better kill myself. :P

    Does a master have any more to learn?
    Definitely! I don't know when mastery got equated with Enlightenment, but I think it's a problem in the West. Mastery doesn't mean you're done! I think it means you've mastered your art to a level where you control it, not vice versa.

    In music, this is all so much clearer. When someone stops being a student and starts being a real musician, you can just hear it in their playing.
    Last edited by Antonius; 3rd September 2004 at 09:49 AM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    119
    I am no master, but if after 20 years of practice I cannot honestly call myself (or be called) at least a low-level master, then I better kill myself. :P
    A master is a master, there aren't really levels of Masterdom (I made that word up ).

    In music, this is all so much clearer. When someone stops being a student and starts being a real musician, you can just hear it in their playing.
    This is true in all things, especially MA. Whan someone actually starts to have fights, their improvement is exponential.
    Does this that all real musicians Maestro's?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Gainesville, Florida
    Posts
    5,414
    A master is a master, there aren't really levels of Masterdom (I made that word up )
    I disagree. I think there are many different levels. For example, Sifu Wong is certainly a master, but his teacher, Sigung Ho Fatt Nam, was at a much higher level. But they are both called masters (or Grandmasters).
    Last edited by Antonius; 3rd September 2004 at 04:47 PM.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    440
    Quote Originally Posted by Antonius
    Sigung Ho Fatt Nam, was at a much higher level.
    Did you have a chance to meet him?

    Sincerely,
    Panu
    Last edited by Ovidius; 3rd September 2004 at 07:21 PM.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Gainesville, Florida
    Posts
    5,414
    Did you have a chance to meet him?
    Sadly, no. But several of my seniors met him, and I live vicariously through their stories.

    To clarify, it is not my assessment that puts Sigung Ho at a higher level that Sifu Wong; it's Sifu's Wong's own assessment.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Surrey
    Posts
    434
    Interesting question Andrew.

    My understanding of this is that (a) grandmaster is/tends to be reserved for the living head of a school and that (b) rather like a gentleman in English no grandmaster would say he is a grandmaster.

    On this basis I would say that Sifu is a grandmaster and the fact that he may not call himself this is further proof under my criterion (b)

    Separately your Swiss clinical tests are brilliant - could we hear more about this in a specific thread? When I have the time I must get round to kicking off a thread re science and Wahnam qigong. Having spoken to a couple of professional scientists in Spain there are some interesting possibilities and angles.

    rgds and congrats

    Mike
    "If you realised how powerful your thoughts are, you would never think a negative thought." Peace Pilgrim.

  10. #10
    Andrew's Avatar
    Andrew is offline Sifu Andrew Barnett - Chief Instructor, Shaolin Wahnam Switzerland
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Klosters, Switzerland
    Posts
    7,160
    Interesting inputs --- but still no definitive answers. We'll see what others have to say maybe

    Andrew
    Sifu Andrew Barnett
    Shaolin Wahnam Switzerland - www.shaolin-wahnam.ch
    Flowing Health GmbH www.flowing-health.ch (Facebook: www.facebook.com/sifuandrew)
    Healing Sessions with Sifu Andrew Barnett - in Switzerland and internationally
    Heilbehandlungen mit Sifu Andrew Barnett - in der Schweiz und International

    Chi Kung Courses : 3t0h September 2017 in Landquart CH
    QEA Discussion Forum: www.qea.ch/forum



Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •