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  • Learning more kung fu

    Hi

    From the videos I've seen, many Shaolin Wahnam members do their training in public parks. Has anyone had experiences of approaching/being approached by other martial arts students (in particular traditional chinese martial arts) and tested skills, exchanged kung fu sets, etc. as Sifu Wong did in the past? I think it would make for a good story to share.

    With the skills gained in the intensive courses, is it easy for any Shaolin Wahnam student to learn kung fu from other styles and assimilate it into ones own training? Even bump it up from an "external" style to an "internal" style, as Sifu Wong has done with praying mantis, eagle claw, hung gar, etc. How would one approach weapons training if he/she has not taken an intensive weapons course before? I would assume weapons training also involves chi flow somehow I'm getting way ahead of myself, but I think these are all interesting to know.

  • #2
    Originally posted by wonderlusterer View Post
    Hi

    From the videos I've seen, many Shaolin Wahnam members do their training in public parks. Has anyone had experiences of approaching/being approached by other martial arts students (in particular traditional chinese martial arts) and tested skills, exchanged kung fu sets, etc. as Sifu Wong did in the past? I think it would make for a good story to share.

    With the skills gained in the intensive courses, is it easy for any Shaolin Wahnam student to learn kung fu from other styles and assimilate it into ones own training? Even bump it up from an "external" style to an "internal" style, as Sifu Wong has done with praying mantis, eagle claw, hung gar, etc. How would one approach weapons training if he/she has not taken an intensive weapons course before? I would assume weapons training also involves chi flow somehow I'm getting way ahead of myself, but I think these are all interesting to know.
    Hiya!

    I actually have not been approached as of yet when training in public, maybe it will happen at the proper time and I will make a good friend. The intensive course is one that is on my wish list, however I have learned the material from my Sifu via private lessons. He is a wonderful teacher, and a wonderful person.

    I can say from direct experience that both are true. One can more easily pick up other martial arts, and one can transfer internal skills to these other martial arts.

    Why?

    Because Sigung has constructed a basic syllabus that gives us the foundation. We get the road map while some other martial arts are driving around in circles. It is quite amazing how lucky we are! We learn not just kung fu sets, but the stances, footwork, body movements, internal force skills, philosophy, and combat skills that are fundamental to bringing all kung fu sets alive.

    I am amazed on at least a weekly basis how deep the basic syllabus material can get.

    Have a good one!
    - David
    Shaolin Wahnam USA

    "Every morning you are born again. What you do today is the most important thing".

    Comment


    • #3
      I think people are too peaceful nowadays

      Comment


      • #4
        I think peace is great. Instead of wasting chi on breaking bones and internal organs, we can use it to live longer healthier and happier Besides, if we only learnt kung fu for fighting, we'd only learn iron palm and iron shirt, IF Sifu Wong even shares those arts (under such circumstances), and never have time to learn the more internal arts

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by wonderlusterer View Post
          With the skills gained in the intensive courses, is it easy for any Shaolin Wahnam student to learn kung fu from other styles and assimilate it into ones own training? Even bump it up from an "external" style to an "internal" style, as Sifu Wong has done with praying mantis, eagle claw, hung gar, etc.
          Well I learned external styles before and after learning from Sifu. I found, once I had experienced chi flow and built some internal force using Sifu's methods, that as long as the other styles were "authentic" at least in terms of forms, that I would feel chi flowing and internal force building whilst I practised those "external" styles as well. But I wouldn't feel this if I did kickboxing or boxing, whether in kickboxing/boxing clubs or in "kungfu" clubs who used kickboxing.

          I remember being in a non-Wahnam Wing Chun class, we were going through the forms and I felt chi surging in my arms. I remember the instructor telling people that they could increase their power by doing weights and thinking to myself "You don't need to!"

          So in my opinion the answer is "yes". Sifu has stated a few times that Shaolin Wahnam members are allowed to practise other styles from other schools as well, though he has also stated, particularly recently via Joan Sije on the forum in reference to the 30 opponent programme, that it is not necessary, and according to my reading, probably even not optimal, to do so.

          I've also done a couple of other "internal" styles, where I believe the good or lucky among the practitioners do feel some chi and build internal force eventually, whereas I was able to feel it flowing and building straight away.

          I was not / am not near a Wahnam instructor and so I sought these people out for training, sparring, more practice etc because I consider some of them good fighters with a lot to offer in terms of getting experience sparring and so forth, even if I don't think their internal development is as good as ours.

          Comment


          • #6
            The monkey behavior

            Interesting thread,

            I will give my humble opinion:

            To think of the possibility to train other styles of martial arts outside our school and then watching what effect one can gain when combined them with Sigung's teaching can be a valid thing to do and it surely brings an interesting experience. But I think that it is not also not necessary as our school is already very rich in Kung Fu styles (all of them giving us the chance to practice at avery high level). I also don't understand why searching somewhere else once one has find an incredible complete school that gives you benefits from the most very basic until the highest level and in which you can learn, practice and achieve skills you could even not dream of before. Specially knowing that other schools cannot give you those benefits.

            As I honestly think that it could also be a hindrance in my development, I would personally not waste my time practicing other styles (teaching, methods, etc.) than those of our school. I truly believe that in doing so one can risk the chance to achieve something more rewarding. I do prefer to be aware not just of the monkey mind but also of the monkey behavior, i.e. the student wanting to taste different Kung Fu styles everywhere like bananas and not going deep in the teachings of his own school. Because at the end for many of us, or at least for me, just mastering the basic syllabus of Shaolin Wahnam Kung fu can take the whole life. And in any case if we want to practice different styles of Kung Fu, then Sigung has already make everything easy for us. The school offers a wide range of styles, all of them at an incredible high level: northern und southern Shaolinquan, Drunken Eight Immortals, Wuzuquan, Praying Mantis, Wing Choon, Xingyiquan, Baguazhang, Taijiquan Yang, Chen and Wudang stiles, Wahnam Taijiquan, Choy-li-Fatt, Eagle Claw, and may be I forget to mention one or two.

            Another thing is of course go to sparring and test the own fighting skills if a friendly manner with people of other schools.



            ShaolinSalute
            Davy
            Last edited by Davy; 5 November 2015, 08:21 AM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Hi Davy,

              Yes, of course theres no doubt at all that even the basic syllabus taught in Shaolin Wahnam is a complete martial, spiritual, and artistic development system. In the past, to learn from a master while under the tutelage of another would be unthinkable and one could be branded as a traitor, though things are different now.

              This idea was simply inspired by Sifu Wong's own adventures in learning different styles of martial arts, from Choe family wing chun to learning taijiquan by himself from studying classics, to great effect. I doubt Shaolin Wahnam would ever be able to offer arts such as Eagle Claw, Praying Mantis, 8 Drunken Immortals, Choy Li Fatt, etc. had Sifu Wong never went out and explored the other styles, even after he realised the treasure he gained from Great Grandmaster Ho. It's interesting to note that Sifu Wong's famous Travelling Dragon Sword, he never claimed to learn it from any one of his four formal teachers/schools, at least not in this article: http://www.shaolin.org/answers/sp-is...ngfu-sets.html

              All that aside though, now that I think about it there was really no practical purpose of starting this thread. Just wanted to see if things like that do happen very often in real life

              Comment


              • #8
                From the videos I've seen, many Shaolin Wahnam members do their training in public parks. Has anyone had experiences of approaching/being approached by other martial arts students (in particular traditional chinese martial arts) and tested skills, exchanged kung fu sets, etc. as Sifu Wong did in the past? I think it would make for a good story to share.
                I am often training outside in summer alone or when teaching a class. Often people stop and watch. Sometimes they ask what style or school it is and comment (nicely). From the way they ask I can generally tell whether they practice a martial arts themselves or are just curious. But that's how far it goes in general.

                There are, in my opinion several reasons, why that's all:
                - in Switzerland we do not have the tradition to test skills with somebody you just met. It would take time to get to know each other before you ask.
                - if somebody challenges another person, this would be because they have a conflict. The martial art would not be important. And if it happens it is more likely to happen when people are drunk or in "gang" environment.
                - most schools if they do practice sparring, do so within their own style or within a very strict set of competition rules. Thus most martial artists are not used to an open sparring/testing their skills.
                - martial arts are mostly practiced for health and fitness today. Most practitioners have little ambitions when it comes to sparring.

                However I had the opportunity to spar with different martial artists both women and men. And I find it is very useful to see what works well and what can be improved. It also allowed me to see that there are so many hard-working and good hearted people in the martial arts community. Many of them are passionate about their arts and open to share about their style and training methods.

                With regards to learning other martial arts or applying skills to other styles. Yes you are right, the skills learned can be applied to other sets, styles or martial arts, once you have practiced for a while.

                If I remember correctly you haven't attended any course in our school, but will be joining the wedding courses. I am looking forward to hear what you think after the courses. Different schools train differently... so what might make sense in theory does not always in practice .

                Best regards
                Andrea
                Enjoy some Wahnam Tai Chi Chuan & Qi Gong!

                Evening Classes in Zürich
                Weekend Classes in other Swiss locations


                Website: www.taichichuan-wahnam.ch
                Facebook: www.facebook.com/Taichichuan.Wahnam.ch

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hi Sifu Andrea,

                  Yes, took quite a bit of effort to convince the bosses to let me off for the week but it's confirmed I will be attending the wedding courses
                  Just wondering, the training hall will be opened the whole day for us to train by ourselves outside of the course hours.
                  Would it be alright if I were to take the opportunity to approach you or some of the other sifu's for pointers during those times, just in case I am not be able to follow the course as well as more seasoned students. I understand that Sifu Wong will probably have to rush off to help with the wedding preparations so I wouldn't want to hold him back if I needed help.

                  I've also been wanting to ask for some time now actually, what could we expect from these upcoming courses? Usually in Sifu's website he gives a brief description, such as the 36 kicking techniques course, legacy of Wong Fei Hung course, etc. This course is like a mystery box Also will it be recorded for reviewing?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by wonderlusterer View Post
                    Would it be alright if I were to take the opportunity to approach you or some of the other sifu's for pointers during those times, just in case I am not be able to follow the course as well as more seasoned students. I understand that Sifu Wong will probably have to rush off to help with the wedding preparations so I wouldn't want to hold him back if I needed help.
                    Just read the article on Sifu's sinew metamorphosis course, from 49 flicks to just 3 flicks. With that level of teaching skill I probably wont have any problems learning though

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Just don't worry, you can do it!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Had all my questions answered in the courses
                        Haven't missed a night of training (at the very minimum, I still make sure I do zhan zhuang)

                        My schedule now goes something like this:
                        Enter chi kung state of mind
                        1) One of the many chi kung exercises taught
                        2) Horse riding stance (I just stand for as long as is comfortable, probably around 1-2 minutes)
                        3) Sequence 1 from dragon in zen. At the end I just run through the whole set to keep in my memory. Will get to sequence 2 later.
                        4) Art of flexibility
                        End with point massage + heavenly drum

                        Interestingly, I now take about 40 minutes to complete everything, when before this I took nearly half an hour just to do lifting the sky 20 times.

                        Would these be some good 3-month goals to set?
                        1) Sit relaxed at horse riding for around 5 mins
                        2) Perform combat sequence at full speed with attention to covering the opponent, etc.
                        3) Notice a significant improvement in posture.

                        -Daniel

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by wonderlusterer View Post
                          Had all my questions answered in the courses
                          Haven't missed a night of training (at the very minimum, I still make sure I do zhan zhuang)

                          My schedule now goes something like this:
                          Enter chi kung state of mind
                          1) One of the many chi kung exercises taught
                          2) Horse riding stance (I just stand for as long as is comfortable, probably around 1-2 minutes)
                          3) Sequence 1 from dragon in zen. At the end I just run through the whole set to keep in my memory. Will get to sequence 2 later.
                          4) Art of flexibility
                          End with point massage + heavenly drum

                          Interestingly, I now take about 40 minutes to complete everything, when before this I took nearly half an hour just to do lifting the sky 20 times.

                          Would these be some good 3-month goals to set?
                          1) Sit relaxed at horse riding for around 5 mins
                          2) Perform combat sequence at full speed with attention to covering the opponent, etc.
                          3) Notice a significant improvement in posture.

                          -Daniel
                          Hi Daniel,

                          That's awesome! I'm glad you were able to attend the complimentary courses and really benefit from them!

                          Sounds like you've got a nice daily practice in the works. I think you're 3-months goals are reasonable, and you should easily be able to meet them. I don't recall you mentioning any postural issues in your past posts, though I may have missed that. Depending on what the issue is, and how far from "normal" your posture is currently, you may see better results for goal #3 with more attention to vigorous Chi Flow, and less attention to Shaolin Kungfu. But if your postural issues are typical of the modern, computer using generation (rounded shoulders, forward head, slumping) then practicing genuine Shaolin Kungfu will have great results.

                          Keep up the good work!

                          -Matt

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Matt F. View Post
                            Hi Daniel,

                            Depending on what the issue is, and how far from "normal" your posture is currently, you may see better results for goal #3 with more attention to vigorous Chi Flow, and less attention to Shaolin Kungfu. But if your postural issues are typical of the modern, computer using generation (rounded shoulders, forward head, slumping) then practicing genuine Shaolin Kungfu will have great results.

                            -Matt
                            Hi Sifu Matt,

                            Yes, just the typical forward head. The horse riding stance training (pulling back the elbows, string pulling up the top of my head, etc) are helping a lot, though honestly I think my posture was at its best for about 2-3 days after the course. Will have to work my way back to that point.

                            -Daniel

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              It was good meeting you in SP Daniel.
                              Excellent training schedule and goals!

                              Keep it up and enjoy the benefits!

                              Best regards
                              Andrea
                              Enjoy some Wahnam Tai Chi Chuan & Qi Gong!

                              Evening Classes in Zürich
                              Weekend Classes in other Swiss locations


                              Website: www.taichichuan-wahnam.ch
                              Facebook: www.facebook.com/Taichichuan.Wahnam.ch

                              Comment

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