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  • When Cleansing gets you down

    Hi folks,

    I am starting this thread for someone else who is unsure about using the Discussion Forum and is looking for feedback regarding their experiences. I have let them know that the thread has started and have replicated all correspondance so far.

    I have removed their name to preserve their identity. If they wish to participate and make themselves known, then they will.

    The initial query was -

    Hi, I am a new student (attended an 3 days Intensive course with Sifu last year). I read your replies in the forum about cleansing experiences of senior students. I hope you may be able to help me understand some experiences I had/have, not sure whether cleansing or something I did wrong. I've read Antonius comments that generally if one is feeling happy then it should be ok. In the past 2 months, I had bouts of pain all over the body, even stepping on my soles hurt, touching the scalp, holding something in the palms, like sharp in the middle chest thorugh the back. Sometimes its as if the pain makes me feverish hot inside, but my skin remains cool. I just want to crawl and sleep. I am just wondering about it, because other people dont seem to see that I am unwell ( I am back again to thinking it must be something not bad then). I would be grateful to hear some other comments. Thank you for your time.
    My reply was -

    <I would require some further information before I could say whether what you are experiencing is perfectly normal cleansing (very possible) or a result of deviations in your practice (also possible). What I would suggest is that you start a new thread in the 'Chi Kung Experiences' part of the forum so you can get feedback and suggestions from several people, instead of just from me.

    Addittional usefull information would be -

    Your daily practice - what do you do & how many times?
    Is the pain constant, or at certain times?
    If it is at certain times, when? Is it after training, during chi flow etc
    How do you actually feel?
    When do you want to 'crawl & sleep'?

    This addittional information would help greatly in being able to offer you advice and assistance.>
    Last edited by Darryl; 21 November 2003, 05:19 PM.

  • #2
    Their reply

    And the reply was -

    <start a new thread in the 'Chi Kung Experiences' part of the forum so you can get feedback and suggestions from several people, instead of just from me>

    I'll try to, it took me long enough to write to anyone! I would really like to get feedback from lady students, bcos I'm wondering if the natural hormone cycles has any effect on our practice and how. I browse the forum occasionaly, but things just did not "click"!
    <Your daily practice - what do you do & how many times?>

    Once a day (40mins-1Hr), combination of lifting sky, pushing mountain + carry moon & standing meditation and weekly of the same + self manifested chimovement. 3x a week, I add in Separating Water, Drawing Moon + Circular Chi Flow. training time: between 10pm - 12midnight or 7-8am.
    <Is the pain constant, or at certain times? If it is at certain times, when? Is it after training, during chi flow etc. How do you actually feel? When do you want to 'crawl & sleep'?>

    I noticed the bout (about 3-5days) since early this year, almost monthly. It will start with a deep pain like tearing in the right chest below rib (during training). Mornings I hv to crawl and stand, telling myself get up never give up! A lot of pain in the back, the right side, right arm, behind right knee, behind right shoulder. My right shoulder goes creaakkk quite alarmingly. I certainly persist with my practice as I feel better when my muscles limber up. The mornings will be a struggle again, followed by dry cough, loud sneezing, and dripping nose. This usually disappears after 5 days, I wonder what would happen if I just rest and stop training for several days?

    Comment


    • #3
      My new reply

      And this is part of my actual reply, to avoid repitition in any other posts.

      <Initially, I would say that you are overtraining. In your daily practice, there is no need to do more than one exercise per session unless you have directly been told to by Sifu. Daily sessions taking you nearly an hour everyday is too much for Chi Kung.

      I would suggest that for the next two weeks, just do Lifting The Sky. Addittionally, you may wish to take a break for a few days beforehand to give your system a break.

      I would suggest that your daily practice every morning and everning be

      Relax
      Smile From the Heart
      Lifting The Sky, 15 - 20 tmes
      Chi Flow, for 5-10 minutes
      Standing Meditation, 2-5 minutes
      Facial Massage
      Points Massage
      Walk about briskly.


      After the two weeks, see how you feel. If you feel fine, then you may substitute one other Chi Kung exercise in place of Lifting The Sky, but avoid combining the different exercises in the same session. The exceptions to these are Self Manifested Chi Movement and Dawing the Moon. Again, I would suggest that you practice only Lifting The Sky for the next two weeks.>

      I would like to repeat their request for feedback from female practitioners and also feedback from anyone that has practiced Drawing The Moon.
      Last edited by Darryl; 21 November 2003, 05:38 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi Darryl,

        Thanks for posting this. I sincerely hope the person who you are generously representing here listens to your excellent advice.

        You mentioned about over-training and I would certainly tend to agree with that from the information presented to date. It is often the case that people consider that if they can get wonderful benefits from 15 minutes of training per session, that if they then practice for say 40 minutes or 1 hour then the benfits will be even greater. This, however, is certainly not the case for high level Chi Kung such as Shaolin Cosmos Chi Kung. With this system it is often more the case of "less is more".

        2 sessions of 15 minutes per day practicing any ONE Chi Kung exercise is more than enough for most people (self-manifested chi movement also counts as one even though 2 or more dynamic patterns are combined to achieve the desired effect). For some other systems this may well not be the case. But we are specifically talking about Shaolin Cosmos Chi Kung taught by Sifu.

        With regards to Drawing the Moon - maybe I missed it ... but what was the question?

        Generally with Drawing the Moon, it should be practices twice per day in addition to "normal" Chi Kung practice. Haphazard or irregular practice will not bring the desired results.

        Hope I have been able to help.

        Andrew
        Sifu Andrew Barnett
        Shaolin Wahnam Switzerland - www.shaolin-wahnam.ch

        Flowing Health GmbH www.flowing-health.ch (Facebook: www.facebook.com/sifuandrew)
        Healing Sessions with Sifu Andrew Barnett - in Switzerland and internationally
        Heilbehandlungen mit Sifu Andrew Barnett - in der Schweiz und International

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by WahnamCH
          With regards to Drawing the Moon - maybe I missed it ... but what was the question?
          Hi Andrew,

          Thanks for the feedback.

          Drawing The Moon was also being practiced everyday and since my advice was to only practice Lifting The Sky for 2 weeks, this means no Drawing The Moon either.

          However, I was mentioning that in general Drawing The Moon can be practiced in addittion to a Chi Kung exercise.

          Comment


          • #6
            Hi Darryl, Andrew and especially to the lady in question,

            I certainly agree with both Darryl's and Andrew's replies.

            It would appear that this lady has been over practising, and I too would suggest that she only practises Lifting the Sky for the time being.

            She says that she took the Intensive course with Sifu, last year, and that it has only been in the last 2 months that these 'bouts' of pain have started. How long, I wonder has she been practising Separating Water, as this is very very powerful and may cause blockages if not practised correctly, also why has she decided to do 'Separating Water' and 'Drawing the moon'. For health reasons or for a better figure.? I used to practice Drawing the Moon but found it very hard to remain relaxed in the beginning It is also important not to raise the feet too high from the ground. So it may be that she is tensing too much in both of these and causing a lot of problems.



            ________________________
            I'll try to, it took me long enough to write to anyone! I would really like to get feedback from lady students, bcos I'm wondering if the natural hormone cycles has any effect on our practice and how. I browse the forum occasionaly, but things just did not "click"!

            ____________________________

            Chi Kung practice balances hormone levels and most women find that it relieves previous symptoms of PMT and other gynaecological problems, however if you feel that your 'bouts of symptoms' are worse at this time, you can slow down your practice or stop altogether. As I, Darryl and Andrew have previously advised, you should slow down your practise anyway to Lifting the Sky for the present.

            Don't be in a hurry to learn and learn new patterns, it is much more important to practice and practice the ones that you have been taught by Sifu or one of the instructors.

            I hope that this helps and please feel free to contact me if you wish.

            Best wishes,
            Joan.
            Books don't mean a lot unless you open them, Hearts are the same.......


            Valentine's Smile from the Heart 2019 IRELAND - world renowned Grandmaster Wong Kiew Kit.

            -A FEAST OF SHAOLIN transmitted by Grandmaster Wong Kiew Kit FEBRUARY 16TH -19TH 2019
            GENERATING ENERGY FLOW
            ONE FINGER SHOOTING ZEN
            THE INCREDIBLE 3 DAY INTENSIVE ZEN COURSE .

            Sifujoan@gmail.com

            Comment


            • #7
              Hi Everyone,

              This very nice lady has written to me personally and has kindly agreed to me posting her reply on the forum. Her reply is as follows:

              Dear Joan,

              thank you very much for your advice. I am sure that I have been adding on other excercises overzealously and certainly haphazardly. Regarding the monthly cycle, I noticed since starting training, my regular symptoms (migraine & feeling of bloatedness) have disappeared. But you are very right that I have started the Separating Water about 2 months ago (hoping vainly for a better figure) and I did not get instructions from any other students, just read it from Sifu's book. I had no idea that it would cause blockages. I started with Lifting the Sky (30times), Drawing Moon (only 3times each way), Rotating Hips (30times each way) followed by Circulating Chi flow. I have stopped all these and resumed training as per Daryl's advice.

              Once again, thank you for your time. Warmest regards.
              _____________________________________

              I hope that her reply may help others not to overpractice, it is a common mistake to think that the more you do the better the results, but with Shaolin Chi Kung as has been said before, 'quality rather than quantity'.

              It may also help some ladies who read the forum to realise that Shaolin Chi Kung is also excellent for hormonal balance, again a big problem with some women. This lady's problems disappeared soon after doing the course with Sifu, despite having very bad migraine for many years.

              I wish her, and all of you many blessings,

              Smile from the Heart,
              Joan.
              Books don't mean a lot unless you open them, Hearts are the same.......


              Valentine's Smile from the Heart 2019 IRELAND - world renowned Grandmaster Wong Kiew Kit.

              -A FEAST OF SHAOLIN transmitted by Grandmaster Wong Kiew Kit FEBRUARY 16TH -19TH 2019
              GENERATING ENERGY FLOW
              ONE FINGER SHOOTING ZEN
              THE INCREDIBLE 3 DAY INTENSIVE ZEN COURSE .

              Sifujoan@gmail.com

              Comment

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