vaccines and immune system

[Vero]

Hello,

Since I started to take care (from a different perspective) about my family´s health and myself I have been wondering about the safety of vaccines. Are they good for the immune system ?

I would really appreciate yor comments,

Thank you

Vero

[geng]

have a look at National Vaccine Information Center on facebook or www.nvic.org

[Maxime]

Are they good for the immune system ?

Most of them are not.

And most of them have absolutely no reasons to be, except to feed big pharmalogical companies (who feed the fear of people by imposing a so-called necessity of vaccination).

Nevertheless, a minority of them are -in my opinion- very safe and of utmost necessity.

Regards,

[Dorit]

Hi urbantis,

to my opinion most common vaccines are not necessary, even in contrary - e.g. Influenza. - But on the other hand, planning a trip to a foreign country where a certain vaccine is claimed: I would take it.

Quite similar, when after a tick bite I see a red mark around this bite (I had this case a few years ago) - this announces a borrelio infection. The doctor will prescribe a vaccine - and antibiotics too. I do not like antibiotics at all. But I will take both if it is said to be necessary just now.

Kind regards,
confermezza

[yeniseri]

Hello,

Since I started to take care (from a different perspective) about my family´s health and myself I have been wondering about the safety of vaccines. Are they good for the immune system ?

I would really appreciate yor comments,

Thank you

Vero

Vaccines are necessary but the degree of their necessity is problematic!
They are safe for most people under most conditions. A minority of individuals do have adverse experiences.

[Anton S.]

Dear Urbantis,

Whether vaccines are good depends on the patient and his necessities.
During the last century it was possible to reduce significantly the deathrate of many newborn and young children due to vaccines. Some viruses do not even exist anymore, due to vaccines.

But you do not need them all. The recommendations depend on the age, health conditions and aims of the patients.

Are they good for immune system?

The mechanism of vaccines is quite simple: vaccines expose the patient to a non-virulent pathogen, thereby creating a specific immunity. E.a. the show the immune system how "the bad bug" looks like, so the immune system knows against whom it has to fight. Same as deseases, vaccines boost the specific immune system.

If you got interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaccine

Some studies on Chi Kung show that Chi Kung can boost the immune system in a non-specific way, increasing the levels of leukocytes (white blood cells).

Don´t worry! keep practicing

Best regards, Anton.

[Vero]

Hello, Thank you all for your comments. I checked the links that you gave me. Personally I was thinking about my little girl and this new vaccines for flu and uterine cancer, this last one specially recommended for young girls.
Thanks again.
Vero

[Maxime]

Caution - Problematic Vaccine

Personally I was thinking about my little girl and this new vaccines for flu and uterine cancer, this last one specially recommended for young girls.

Vero, I would personnally avoid the uterine cancer vaccine for little girls... There have been too many problems in the world with this dangerous vaccine (Gardasil, Cervarix).

Best,

Maxime

[Zhang Wuji]

I read this years ago, and it still makes perfect sense to me. I think flu shots are potentially dangerous and unnecessary, but who am i to judge. I am not a qualified pharmaceutical scientist or FDA expert.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2001/03/17/chicken-pox.aspx

By Gary Krasner

After learning this month of the legislative attempt to make the varicella vaccine mandatory in New York, I looked for a handle for an article. Since I didn't recall that chicken pox had ever been grouped in the category of medicine's infamous "Killer Diseases",

I thought I should find out how the Medical Boys justified making it compulsory for school children.

It became apparent that the only medical justification for this vaccine had been the claimed mortalities. I went to the CDC's website and found something revealing in the May 15, 1998/Vol. 47/No. 18 issue of Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report (MMWR, their official publication). It was entitled, "Varicella-Related Deaths Among Children: Texas and Iowa notified CDC of three fatal cases of varicella (chickenpox) that occurred in children during 1997" (reprinted in Appendix A below).

A short introduction stated that in the U.S. there are approximately 100 deaths (about half of these in children) and 10,000 hospitalizations each year for complications from chicken pox from infection with the varicella virus.

After going over the report, I remembered why I stopped reading medical journals. In each of the three cases the young boys started out with fevers and/or other minor inflammatory conditions.

Following each regimen of antibiotics, analgesics, or steroidal medications their condition grew progressively worse.

The doctors responded to each new symptom with yet another drug, until the children died.

Having an understanding of Natural Hygiene (note: it is briefly described by Harvey Diamond in his best seller, Fit For Life), I understood why the children got progressively worse from the drugging. But even equipped with a rudimentary understanding of the principles of N.H., one would realize that chicken pox is not a fatal disease, but rather a very common, benign inflammatory condition. And fatalities-as rare as they are-must actually result from inappropriate care, or the kinds of aggressive medical interventions described in the MMWR report.

With paraphrasing here and there, the next 9 paragraphs is taken from the section on chicken pox from the 1965 book, "Food Is Your Best Medicine" by Henry Bieler, M.D. He was a renowned clinician practicing in Pasadena, CA for over 50 years until his death in 1975. Dr. Bieler's skills were sought after by Hollywood celebrities and honored by his peers (a medical wing was named after him). His book is still available from Random House.

Chicken pox arises from the elimination of toxic fat or fatty acids through the hair fat glands.

The chemical burn from the purging of waste products though the skin causes the characteristic blister of this disease. This occurs when the liver is congested and cannot perform its eliminative function and metabolic waste matter (toxins) is then thrown into the bloodstream. These toxins in the blood must be discharged, so nature uses vicarious avenues of elimination, or "substitutes".
When these bile poisons (from the liver) in the blood come out through the skin, we get skin conditions manifested by rashes, boils, acne, etc. Or they come out through the mucous membranes (inside skin) manifesting as various catarrhs, like chicken pox. Thus, the skin is "substituting" for the liver, or a vicarious elimination is occurring through the skin.

Food And Drugs Are Contraindicated

During the more acute and involved forms of toxemia, such as measles, chicken pox, fever, or flu, the liver is much too busy neutralizing toxic wastes to be bothered with digestion of food. Therefore, to facilitate the elimination of this waste, fasting on distilled water is essential in such cases. This accounts for the lack of digestive juices produced, and the loss of appetite that accompanies these illnesses.

(Dr. Mercola Note: Please be very clear that distilled water is not appropriate for long term use. You should use bottled spring water or filtered water.)

After cells have been damaged by the toxic wastes, it is important for bacteria-acting as scavengers-to attack and devour the weakened, injured and dead cells. Otherwise, these dead cells would become accumulated toxic waste themselves.

Therefore, antibiotics and other bactericides must not be administered.
The so called "bad" bacterial strains die out on their own anyway, once their food (toxic waste) is used up. But until that point, they play an important role in the process that converts waste for eventual elimination.

The class of drugs that doctors use to treat catarrhal diseases are called antipyretics. Among antipyretics, aspirin tops the list of favorites. Aspirin is a phenol (carbolic acid) derivative, with all the chemical qualities of phenol, but without the deadly effect of carbolic acid. Aspirin, like phenol, deadens the nerve endings, thereby masking pain.

But aspirin also diminishes a fever by partially blocking the thyroid and the adrenal glands (a bad thing). The phenol derivatives interfere with the proper function of the liver and damage liver cells.

The use of aspirin, then, is an attempt to drive out one devil (disease toxins) by admitting another devil!

The Importance Of Fever

Fever in a child is a frightening symptom to the mother. Just what is the function of fever? Is it a harmful process, something to suppress and worry about? Or is it the body's attempt to burn up a poison, thereby helping to dispose of it more quickly?

In the diseases of childhood, fever begins in the liver. In a very strong, robust child, with properly functioning endocrine glands, the toxin is often completely consumed in the liver. The child does not feel sick or have pain; he just has a fever and if the liver area is carefully palpated, it can be noted that there is an elevation of temperature over that organ.

In fact, if the temperature under the tongue is 105 degrees, the internal temperature of the liver may be as high as 110 degrees. But if the liver is unable to oxidize completely the poisons of disease so that some leak through into the blood stream, then, under the action of the endocrine glands, the poisons seek vicarious outlets via the mucous membranes. This may be through the upper respiratory tract, diagnosed by doctors as flu, sinusitis, pharyngitis, tonsillitis and possibly even pneumonia, which is a complicated kind of bronchitis. All through this process, the whole power of the liver is diverted into neutralizing the toxic wastes of disease, as evidenced by the fever.

The liver is much too busy to be bothered with the task of the digestion of food.
Great strain can be taken off that organ if no food is given. Not only does fasting lower the temperature, relieve the distress and facilitate elimination, but it also lessens the strain on the liver and prevents serious complications, such as middle-ear disease, mastoiditis and meningitis.

Left alone, a fever will not exceed 106 degrees.

And only about 4 percent of children experience fever-related convulsions, with no serious aftereffects.

A fast (on distilled water, or at least diluted fruit or vegetable juices) should be continued for twenty-four hours after the temperature has returned to normal.
A good rule to remember is that the bowel can be cleared of toxins (by physic or enemas) in twenty-four hours; the blood in three days; the liver in five days, providing no food is eaten. Shingles ("adult chicken pox"), an eliminative crisis through the mucous membranes that occurs in adults, may require about a week-long fast to completely clear up.

It appears then, that fever, dreaded because misunderstood, is really nature's attempt to help.

It is discomforting, but never does harm; never is attended with serious aftereffects and never should be suppressed with anti-inflammatory drugs or fed with food. I have seen many a case of flu pushed into a pneumonia because some anxious grandmother insisted upon something "to give the child strength", such as chicken broth or a thin starchy gruel, both liquids, of course, but protein and starch-just what the liver cannot handle at this point.

The True Cause Of "Infectious" Disease

From Dr. Bieler's words (above) we gain a little understanding of Natural Hygiene. So-called "infectious" diseases like chicken pox, measles, or whooping cough are actually inflammatory diseases. The symptoms during such illnesses should be viewed as eliminative crises.

They may be very painful, but they're a necessary self-limiting process in which an accumulation of retained metabolic waste (dead cells that become toxic), and the residues of undigested, unassimilated foods are being purged from the body through vicarious (abnormal, inappropriate) channels such as the skin or lungs.

Thus, the familiar runny nose, cough, stiffness, fever, and numerous rashes, swellings, lesions, and eruptions through the skin are all manifestations of the same cause-which are not pathogenic microbes.

Microbes like bacteria, for example, act as scavengers to consume the toxic wastes and the dead cells following inflammation. Their formation and growth do not precede the diseased state in the host, but rather emerge in its wake; and not exogenically-from say, an "infected" person-but rather endogenically, from the genetic material contained in a cell's nucleus after the cell's death and decomposition.

Fortunately, a wide range of bacterial strains, or their genetic "blueprints" (e.g., the various cellular and sub cellular-or "filterable"-stages that bacteria cycle through), inhabit our bodies all the time in titers low enough that their waste products do not affect us.

Recently reported villains like salmonella, e. coli, or streptococcus are enteric and ever-present inside us. The viruses associated with measles, polio, influenza, and all the rest are also present-both in health and disease-and may have only an associative relationship with the diseases, but no proven causative roles. (Incredibly, modern medicine still hasn't determined the mechanism by which a virus causes poliomyelitis.)

But when we become toxemic and our blood loses its alkalinity, the pathogenic strains begin to flourish in the bodily waste that accumulates-even well before any outward symptoms (inflammation and elimination) begin to appear. Their morphology (strain and function) is determined by the type of waste that is present for them to feed upon.

Symptoms are often triggered by a physiochemical or psychological "trauma", such as
• exposure to cold or toxic chemicals
• stress
• lack of sleep
• ingestion of spoiled meat
• a sting or bite from an insect
• an injected vaccine

Why these diseases occur predominantly in children is best described by Dr. Bieler:

"The childhood years should be the healthiest of all. It is during those early years that the endocrine glands and the liver are in their best functional capacity, giving the healthy child his natural state of exuberance, inexhaustible energy, and faultless elimination".

When elimination ends and symptoms subside, doctors will proclaim that the drug had "taken effect". But they are confusing symptoms with cause; believing that the disappearance of the former equates to the disappearance of the latter. But obviously a cause and an effect cannot be one in the same. When you stop the body from discharging toxic waste, you are not stopping the disease; you are merely stopping the effects.

In other words, neither allopathy, nor any other healing philosophy may claim responsibility for "curing" inflammatory or catarrhal diseases. Because the disease symptoms-the remedial actions initiated by our own bodies-themselves represent the "cure".

But more importantly, when Allopathic physicians employ pain killers, fever suppressants, steroids and other drugs-which are sub-lethal doses of poisons-they have the effect of weakening the patient to the extent of checking elimination.

This is a dangerous effect, because the waste products of these germs that have fed on the dead cells, together with the irritation from the toxins themselves may be absorbed into the blood, and irritating the already overworked liver-which is the detoxification center of the body.

Antibiotics-which literally means "against life"-act chiefly by violently stimulating the adrenal glands. But if they are weak or depleted, the disease runs a chronic, often recurring course. In the aftermath of these germicides, there are also left fewer germs to convert waste, and no means to carry off and eliminate the dead cells. Not surprisingly, there are more deaths today from septicemia (blood poisoning caused by toxic waste from putrefactive bacteria) than there were before the use of antibiotics. (One of the boys from the MMWR report died from it.)

Reactions from antibiotics include
• anaphylactic shock
• aplastic anemia
• induced virulent infections

Deaths from penicillin still occurs today.

Chicken Pox Doesn't Kill; Doctors Kill

It's now plain to see why the children described in the afore-referenced MMWR had died. They were given numerous antibiotics, steroids, antipyretic and antipruritic medications and other fever suppressers, some administered directly into their bloodstreams. Probably they were given food to eat as well, even during the height of their inflammatory responses.

The CDC admits that children don't die from chicken pox per se, but rather "complications" from chicken pox. But what they don't say is that these complications are all derived from acute blood toxemia established by the very treatments used by allopathic physicians. So strictly speaking, all children that die, do so from the allopathic medical treatments that are used to treat the symptoms that accompany chicken pox. There has never been a recorded death among the many thousands of children treated Hygienically, and without drugs.

What does the CDC list as the most common complication?

Pneumonia and secondary bacterial infections (caused by the antibiotics). Other complications, according to the CDC, include encephalitis (inflamed brain tissue mostly from the antipyretics), hemorrhagic complications (such as intestinal bleeding, are the most common symptoms of aspirin-an anticoagulant, or "blood thinner"), hepatitis (congested and inflamed liver caused by the antipyretics), arthritis (decalcification of bone for the calcium needed to neutralize acidic blood, mostly caused by the aspirin), and Reye's syndrome (most commonly associated with giving aspirin to children that have chicken pox or influenza).

Like aspirin and other anti-inflammatory drugs, acetaminophen (ie. Tylenol) will also burden the liver and kidneys and check the vital actions of the body to discharge waste from the blood. Acetaminophen poisoning is also common because it throws the chemistry of the liver off. In fact, it is the most common drug-induced cause of liver failure. It depletes hepatic glutathione, causing the toxic metabolite NAPQI to fail to conjugate, which leads to hepatic injury, and sometimes death.

Therefore, to say that "death is a complication of chicken pox", is like saying, "bleeding is a complication of holding a knife in your hand": each event is neither contingent nor a consequence of the preceding one. Their association is artificial; requiring specific intervening actions to take place. In cases of chicken pox, actions that are in accord and mandated by standard medical practice.

To promote the vaccine, the CDC proclaims that, "varicella (chicken pox) is the leading cause of vaccine-preventable deaths in children in the United States."

But while the deaths are certainly preventable, they have nothing to do with the failure to vaccinate.

[Antonius]

Vaccines are a hugely controversial subject. Both sides tend to get very emotional. After doing a lot of research, Akemi and I have decided that we will not vaccinate our children. Of course, we will take other measures to ensure that our children have robust immune systems.

[Maxime]

Yes Sihing.

There are plenty of evidence out there, both in research and daily life (by the way, why should we rely only on documented researches, and not also on the empirical experiences of life itself...) that shows most vaccines are a BIG problem for children's health.

I am not against vacccines, BUT they must be very carefully selected and most importantly applied in very limited quantities, if any.

Among the numerous studies which have been done, a 2011 German study shows that vaccinated children have 2 to 5 more diseases and disorders than unvaccinated children.

Unbelievable for those who blindly trust the medicus corpus, but true...

[Anton S.]

Among the numerous studies which have been done, a 2011 German study shows that vaccinated children have 2 to 5 more diseases and disorders than unvaccinated children.

Dear Maxime Sisook,

I followed the link, yet could´t find the quotations, neither the authors. There is no raw data access, neither a publication quote. For me it´s just hard to tell, how reliable the data really is. It seems that the journal simply posts some diagrams without reference.

Suppose the data is valid. Then we still don´t know why are vaccinated children are more likely to have asthma in comparison to the unvaccinated?

Maybe children who get vaccines are from a higher risk group (more likely to get diseases or higher social status). Then we could say, that the risk group can trigger diseases, as well as higher social class does trigger asthma and allergies. On the other hand it can be that children from rural area are more unlikely to get vaccines. They in turn are also unlikely to get asthma and allergies.

It´s just hard to tell, because the article lacks this information, as well as p-values (levels of significance). I could´t find the quoted article on scientific databases (medline / pubmed)

The quoted KiGGS Survey is done by the Robert Koch Institute, which in turn releases yearly a list of suggested vaccines for German population. Their data will be coherent to the list of suggested vaccines, I guess. publication list and outcomes: http://www.kiggs.de/

I guess it´s up to everyone to decide whether vaccines make sense or not and it´s good to have valid information available to make this decision.

I just remember a story a children doctor told us in the class: his former neighbors were against vaccines and then one child got pertussis (it was around christmas) and after a few days among the neighbors on his street was a little epidemy with 14 children with pertussis, as well as one 83 old Grandmother. As far as I remember all of them (not sure about the Grandma) survived the whooping cough and the doctor complained about his work on christmas.
But this is a very serious condition.

Another serious disease is mumps. It can trigger infertility in little boys or infect the central nervous system.

To be honest, I would prefer to have a risk for asthma (if this is the case at all) to these serious infections. But it´s everybody´s choice to decide.

Best regards, Anton.

[Dorit]

To me it is clear that vacchines disturb the immune system of children - the smaller the worse. Babies do not have an own immune system; they are beginning to build it up, and children's diseases help doing so. Any vacchination at this early time can only be harmful to this process!

I have read somewhere (but lost the source, unfortunately) that some decades ago children got measles at the age of 5-10 (me too). It is found out that children today tend to get them in babies' age - if their mothers are vacchined against measles! Though measles are not harmful - babies often get complications, because their immune system has not built up.

[Anton S.]

Babies do not have an own immune system; they are beginning to build it up, and children's diseases help doing so.

It´s good, that you bring it up, because I and many fellow students / doctors thought so previously. I remember someone asked one of the German experts in that field during class, whether diseases build the immune system more then vaccines. According to the current research this is not the case. A disease or a vaccine will boost the immune system of a child (no matter how small) just the same.

I have read somewhere (but lost the source, unfortunately) that some decades ago children got measles at the age of 5-10 (me too). It is found out that children today tend to get them in babies' age - if their mothers are vacchined against measles! Though measles are not harmful - babies often get complications, because their immune system has not built up.

The age switch is because the older children are usually vaccinated, they don´t get measles. The non- or not-completly vaccinated younger children get the measles. This is the reason for measles to occur in a earlier age.

But also the wide use of antibiotics has led people to get more serious bacterial infections (measles is a viral infection) more often and more early, than half a century ago. Yet the same wide use of antibiotics has led people to survive infections much better that half a century ago. It´s just a very difficult field..

With best regards, Anton.

[Maxime]

Anton,

just do a search about the link between autism and vaccines. You will get astonished. Autism rate increases proportionally with the number of vaccines per child. Strange, isn't it?

And next time you see your Sifu, just ask him to tell you the story of his last children ... one vaccinated heavily and one on a very low basis. The differences in recurrent disorders speak for itself.

Simply search around you, asking people who get their children heavily vaccinated and those who do not -or not so heavily-, then compare the quality of life between these children, and you'll get what I mean then.

Direct experience versus twisted statistics. Do not forget that much of the researches are done with the financial credits of pharmaceutical companies... Should I explain further?

You can make any kind of twisted extrapolations, like which children are living in countryside or this or that... in the end vaccines have a lot to reveal against themselves.

Have a nice Sunday!